Will Fulwider 0:01
Welcome Field Notes Today we’re talking about integrating annual slash alternative forages in Wisconsin. Michael, why, why are we talking about this? What’s the big deal here?

Michael Geissinger 0:11
Yeah, I think this is something that came up a lot last year, maybe with the drought. Maybe this year is a little bit different. And we’ll talk about during the episode, but I think the key word that I think about what I think about like warm season annual forages, like we’re going to be chatting about here is adaptability and kind of that opportunity to add something into the rotation or in a certain year, that can kind of help you pivot and manage your forage inventory. And thankfully, I’m not gonna be the expert on the call today talking about everything, because we have Yoana Newman from UW River Falls and faculty expense extension specialists with UW Madison extension. And Matt Oehmican, one of the Oehmicans at short lane ag supply in central Wisconsin, here to chat with us. So Yoana, Matt, thanks for joining us are glad to have you on to chat about this topic. And I’m actually just getting started here with Matt today. So we know like dairy and livestock producers in Wisconsin are always looking for those adaptive ways to produce forage for feed, especially during like abnormal weather years, like drought years. How are warm season annual forages an opportunity for Wisconsin farms, Matt?

Matt Oehmican 1:26
So to answer your question, I like it when you use that word adaptability. And I usually like to refer to flexibility as well. And when I use that word flexibility, you can really take advantage of delayed planning scenario. So let’s say if that new seating or that silage, opportunity wasn’t present there due to weather conditions or field conditions, you have a wide range of different species that you can plug and play and even combine and work that into these delayed planning scenarios like we’re witnessing now. And a lot of these species can cover a lot of different conditions, whether it’s like drought, heavy rain, but that’s that’s something that is a really helpful arsenal to have, especially when you’re working with growers trying to maintain forage opportunities. Great

Will Fulwider 2:23
and Yoana what, what are the types of when we talk about summer annual forages? What are we talking about as far as species here for Wisconsin?

Yoana Newman 2:31
All right. Thanks, Will and Michael, for the opportunity to be here. To answer your question. Here in Wisconsin, we can grow summer annuals like the sorghums. They tend to grow more during the hottest month of the summer. And they have forage sorghum, Sudan grass, sorghum, Sudan hybrid. And additionally on that group, where we have the species that are adapted to the very hot conditions. We have things like Pearl millet, while it’s not in the sorghum family, it is very drought tolerant. So we have other species that can be used in that summer. Using mats in term, you know, for flexibility, you know, we have things you know, like TEF, but you know, or things like crabgrass, but those will have a little bit more emotional requirements. So we’re strictly talking alternatives for more of the very dry drought, hot weather like we had last summer, we’re dealing with the sorghums, circumstan, hybrids and permelia. They’re excellent options, that we provide that flexibility in use.

Michael Geissinger 3:56
Thanks, Joanna. And, and then Matt, when you’re working with farmers out a short lane, you know, we just talked about a bunch of different species, I don’t know how many of them you work with. But what does that decision making process look lik when you’re working with farmers or planting it yourself? As far as you know, what species to choose? What blend to choose? Are you thinking about certain farm or certain species of livestock that they’re trying to feed?

Matt Oehmican 4:22
Oh, certainly, I would say that. The first question is, who? Who are you feeding us to? Is this going to be driven for milk production? Or is this feeding some heifers or are you just taking care of some beekeepers? And then the second question is, what is the field condition and field history of these acres that it’s going on? Meaning is this going to be well drained? Is it dry? Is it heavy? is a saturated wet, and what time he is looking to get in there and then the other when I say get in there, like for planting wise, you know, you don’t want to really tell somebody like getting into like that. July timeframe of like, well, let’s go with a forage sorghum that’s going to be like 100. And some days until it gets to that, that that dough Stage Right? Or it’s going to take it like 90 days to get to boot stage. You really don’t want to push that envelope. But yeah, the first conversation is is like, what kind of quality feed do we want? Do you on tonnage, do you want high density? High digestibility. And then we’re environmental conditions going into so she talks about Pearl millet, well drained ground Pearl millet of all the millets if you were gonna pick one, Pearl millet is like your, your top tier one, right? That one’s gonna be excellent quality. But if you’re gonna go into like some heavy ground like you see in North Central Wisconsin around like, Colby, Clark County Marathon County, that pearl millet can only go in so many places and work really well. And that’s why we kind of lean towards Japanese millet. If somebody’s asking for millet specifically because Japanese mill it just eats up the slot loves that what condition. So that one is something that we would default to. So you don’t want to necessarily just give a blank recommendation without first really doing your homework of what environmental conditions you’re getting into. And another one is like expectation. So if somebody’s like, Hey, listen, I, if I can count it for forage, or if I can get my animals to graze on it, that’s great. But if it could just sit out there, that’s fine, too. Well, then we kind of lean towards like a really basic no nonsense mix where it’s like small grains, brassicas and somes annual clovers, where it’s just like, hey, this doesn’t look that bad. I’m gonna cut this, if you know dry matter ton yield wise, we’ll see like maybe one and a half, maybe up to four times how long you’d want it to go for. Feed ability is fairly decent when it’s 70 brassica, but you know what I mean? You can adapt those mixes to whatever kind of goal or needs that that that farmer is looking for.

Will Fulwider 6:53
Great. And I think this is a question for both of you. So you can kind of just jump in. When I think of the summer annual forages like it’s either. I feel like it often tumbles down to it’s either a millet or sorghum Sudan grass is kind of like your big grass species. And then you can throw in some other things into that mix. I’m wondering like, what is the what is the thought process behind choosing one or the other? Or maybe you know, you do both. But like, what does the millet have over sorghum Sudan grass, and vice versa. And

Yoana Newman 7:20
the first thing would be you know where you’re at. Or you could be Northwest, or you could be in central South Wisconsin. And then the difference between these areas is that you have a two week basically, it boils down to, there’s a two week difference. So probably our summer would be limited, you know, in northwest, as opposed to south, central South, then comes to as, as mentioned earlier, you know, the type of soil you have, what to choose what species, there are some of them like brassica, they require, they’re more adapted to a little bit cooler weather. So you either planted really early in the in the say late, late spring, early summer, more if they’re more like a late spring, or they’re going to come later in the in the summertime for planting. And then you have you know, like the in between like the hardcore summer, that’s going to be your sorghum, sorghum, Sudan. You know, depending on the use, you will have things, you know, brown midrib, you know, they’re going to be less lignin more geared to your dairy situation, higher nutritional requirements, animals, whether that’s dairy, or beef, if you’re finishing, then it comes to the type of soils. You know, if you have basic soils, the sorghums, in general, they do very well. But they don’t like wet feet. If you have things, you know, that are more. You know, if you’re into a more clay type, you know, then that’s where the choosing of you know, your forage sorghum, or some other species, you know, play come into play.

Will Fulwider 9:22
Great. Matt, do you have anything to follow up with that on?

Matt Oehmican 9:25
You know, I’ll take a different kind of spin. And somebody could say like, Well, that seems really simple math. A lot of times it just comes down to what what’s your access for equipment and what kind of time do you do you have with it? And a lot of times, I will lean on what the farmer or grower has had experience working with, because when it’s crunch time like this, there also has to be an element of user friendliness if that can be a correct term. So if they’ve used millets, before or sorghums before, then you want to kind of ease into that more. But generally speaking, when if, if we’re going to be focusing on that question you pose, I see millets a lot of time being intermingled in cocktail mixes or in raising mixes are somebody that has like, has a well established, chopping some whereas sore gums are most popular for guys and gals that have like the corn silage setup, where they’re like, Hey, I liked the idea of just like to cut system while Okay, well, let’s do that sorghum, Sudan grass, or listen, I just want to do like a one cut system, lob that stuff down. and away I go. And I want to have similar tonnage that I see with corn silage, well, then we’re going to lean on those forage sorghums. Right. And, you know, we also don’t want to miss out on life. Some of the other goodie goods that come with some rando forages, so like Italian ryegrass that was really, really hot and popular, especially a couple of years ago, and it’s still remains an option. And it was kind of competing against perennial systems for a while. But that poses like a multiple cuts system where you get really good tonnage and excellent feed quality, and you get really good opportunity to have that grazing scheme. Right. But I would say that a lot of times it comes down to like what’s a similar set of that people are used to. So to reiterate, once again, like if somebody is used to corn silage cutting scheme, then almost every time sorghum Sudan or forage sorghum becomes the key issue, or a key issue and the key species to use,

Yoana Newman 11:37
if I may add, you know, totally agree with Matt there. The wherever the farmer has rancher has, you know, in terms of equipment, or accessibility to equipment is going to dictate what he can do. Maybe, you know, we have a very wet year like this one, and they’re all kind of, you know, kind of piggybacking into, hey, can we use this equipment can we borrow, especially if they’re thinking of making veilige? Now, because it’s been hard to find, kind of like that window of three to four days of clear weather? So, but, you know, you may think about, okay, this is my, you know, maybe ideally for doing some veilige, but you may not have a rapper to do to do the wrapping after you cut your bales. Yeah, so, so basically, you know, the decision making, you know, is the adaptation of the species when you’re looking at what to choose from, but the, the, the farmer rancher, it’s key as to what are his needs, in terms of animals, and in terms of equipment that he has, or how intense you know, we have some guys that are really, you know, cutting edge on things, and we have some others that, you know, excellent in their work, but that’s not what they want, you know, they do not may not be interested in doing a multicam, but maybe having some more cover crop ground cover. So any of these, you know, could be a good alternative for for that, keeping the ground, you know, covered there.

Michael Geissinger 13:18
Yeah, definitely. And that transitions pretty well into our next conversation, which is around the management piece. And so we know, the management of these different species will probably play a factor into which one a farmer will choose to grow on their farm. So let’s just say like, once someone’s made that decision to grow, one of these species that we’ve been talking about, there’s definitely some unique management considerations, maybe compared to growing any of the other kinds of forages that we have in Wisconsin for like cool seasons, for example. So let’s talk about a few of those. And so, Yoana, you’ve kind of mentioned that a little bit, but would you want to talk a little bit more about when the species would usually be planted for Wisconsin?

Yoana Newman 14:06
Right? Certainly. So if we’re talking about the sorghums, right. There, they’re, you know, like mentioned there, they evolve in in that semi arid areas, their Center for Aging, centers of origin go back to Africa, the areas that are in in tropical areas there. So, for management of this, we have the ceiling single cutting, that we can use for fermentation, whether silage or Baleage. We can use for each types that they have that larger stem that we talked about, with limited you know Rigo regrowth or the red TuneIn as it’s called after maturity. The single cuts options could be brown meat rip, which is a reduced lignin those, you know, tend to have like the brown mid rib in them. And that’s an indication of higher digestibility or the reduced lignin that provides that higher digestibility they can be used as a single cut in maybe two to six weeks after heading for increased yield and quality, the dry matter there would range from five to nine tonnes per acre. And then the cutting or chopping should be too low stubble, as you know, you want to get as much of the yield. And driving in the field should be slow, so the candidate is consistent. Otherwise, if you know if you if you’re not, if you’re not careful, then you’re going to be leaving on even struggle hide in the field. If use in this manner, Chaplin’s should be one and a quarter inch. Then we have the multiple multiple cutting options that include the Sudan grass. Remember the thinner stem, or the sorghum Sudan hybrids, these have the ability to return or grow from tillers after the first cut. As long as we don’t let it complete their maturity or head out once their head out totally, totally, it’s kind of game over. You know, if we’re talking Northwest, where we are this far north, we may have one or two cuttings depending on planting date. So if you plan earlier, you’re going to have more clinics, if planted in June, maybe two, three harvests. And then if planted in July, early, possibly one one coding, maybe two depending on when your first freeze will come. Multiple cutting will provide higher quality and yield per quality cause you’re harvesting mostly for vegetative, and you know more younger, less mature material. And then you know, the dry matter yield seasonal would be or would range between five to nine tons per acre. If doing a first garden or use bracing needs to be at 40 inches, or 40 days after planting, just because the sorghums they tend to have high cyanide or what what leads to prussic acid. Second currents and later cuttings should be done at about third you know, every four weeks and to an inch to an 18 inch regrowth. You know which which that could be your your signal for grace. In the case of permelia. Either it has plenty of tillering you know, as we talked earlier, below it, you know, great quality, but millet is less consistent into what you’re getting. And we see that same seed, same quality, same practices, same conditions. And sometimes it’s not as reliable into what you’re gaining. So that’s something to consider there. permelia can be rotationally graze every two to four weeks, leaving about a six two h inch Stubble Height. And unlike the sorghum, sorghum, sorghum, hybrid permelia does not cause prussic acid poisoning, and is safe. In the case, you know, we’re talking mostly beef and dairy. But if you have horses, this is one alternative that you can use horses you cannot use sorghums. But permelia doesn’t have that, that issue with them. dry matter yield for permeabilities ranges from four to six tonnes per acre.

Will Fulwider 19:09
Thank you so much Yoana. A lot on that management piece. And Matt, I kind of want to push it to you now and to talk about the quality management piece like how does this fit into like our, our rotation as far as feeding for dairy cattle? What’s nutrition there? How do we manage it? agronomically like Yoana was talking about the cuts in the quality. And then how does that translate kind of to the feeding aspect of it. You know,

Matt Oehmican 19:36
a lot of these a lot of these guys and gals on the dairy side of things will have these nutritionists that will dial right in and the feedback that I get is you don’t when it when it comes to like the sorghum is your BMR sixes and that’s really key to to understand as you can have some sorghum Sudan and BMRs or sorghum BMR that are averaged eyes, but that doesn’t necessarily mean it’s like a quality brown midrib. So one of the things that we always focus on is like if it’s a BMR six, especially on the sorghum, Sudan grass side of things, so that nothing is missed out. But when it comes to stuff that has like the heart, that higher carbon content, you really don’t see a lot of places having to really adjust their rations, I know that it becomes a little bit trickier when you start working with like, the more the more exotic mixes were like it’s a whole plethora of like annual clovers and brassicas especially because there’s just not a lot of fiber to it. Right? So then you got to supplement it quite a bit. When it comes to that nutritional side of things. I always lean that responsibility on the farmer, because they know their animals far better than I do. But I know that there’s less, there’s less headaches when you’re working with something that has really good digestibility like your Italian rye grasses, a pearl millet, not necessarily Japanese are definitely not a preucil Millet, and then also with your sorghum Sudan grass is that there’s less with that. One thing I would like to talk about when you’re talking about quality side of things. The one common element is nobody focuses on the fertility aspect. There’s when everybody goes with the summer annuals, they do great and low pH they do great and low fertility. But then they always will say the same thing like that second cutting wasn’t as good. Or when I got to that third cutting it was just skimpy. Like we’re talking and telling rye grasses, well, because there’s no fertilizing. And it also goes like into peas and oats, people will be like, I don’t know why, Matt, you totally do these peas and oats. Like I don’t think it was that great. I’m like, Well, what did you do for like, fertility out there and put anything out there. You know what I mean? A lot of these when it’s forages, you got to remember that those plants have to build tissue, they have to build tissue, they got to have good cell structure, and they need a lot of energy to get to that height. And to get to that quality. And if you skimp out on the fertility management side of things, then you’re leaving, you’re leaving quality out on the field, right and you’re not getting 100% value. And I’m not advocating that you got a dump truck a bunch of fertilizer out there. But I think it’s appropriate to keep in mind if you’re especially working with sorghum Sudan grass, watch what the nitrogen and sulfur rates are going to be that you want to have that applied out there especially after that first cutting so that that regeneration and that rebound of those plants is a little bit easier to develop that regrowth and to keep tracking or potassium levels that is so common and hay systems and silage systems, potassium levels tank that everybody wonders why they get sick looking grass over time or the have they have like some yield drops because nobody focuses on the potassium levels, because potassium drives cellular structure and tissue development. So that equates to yield and quality right lead to development standability everything. So that would be the other thing and snap plus I know some people will grumble they’ll snap plus but they give really good talking or they give good when I say good numbers, it gives you something to think about about if you want to hit this kind of yield mark. These are the kind of volumes of like for urea, AMS potash that you should consider if you want to maintain your fertility or if you want to hit the yield marks now was something else that I learned from, from this guy Jason Cavadini, when he was doing his Italian ryegrass studies where you saw a positive impact when there was timely, whether it was dry or liquid nitrogen applications, but even there, when it was third, or fourth application, he was noticing that there was differences in the fertilizer uptake. So that’s something where if somebody really wanted to explore more, Jason had a great study on that showing nitrogen uptake. And yield wise when it came with Italian ryegrass, where he showed if we didn’t fertilize it, we didn’t get as good a yield or quality. But there also was a fine line that it was over fertilized too. And I’ll just leave it at that.

Will Fulwider 24:24
Yeah, I mean, I think that aspect of the potassium and there’s other macronutrients not just nitrogen being important to growth into you know, replacement, because that’s the other part of that is when you’re dealing in forages, you’re taking the whole plant off the field. You know, it’s not recycling those nutrients back into the soil. And so you got to replace everything that you’re pulling out, at least in order to keep on having that plant grow.

Matt Oehmican 24:46
Well, that’s an it’s a simple concept. If I went out to the woods right now, and I clear cut the whole entire thing. Why does stuff grow back in the spring then, like, in a couple of years, you’ll see popples you’ll see brush You’ll see grass, everything just comes right back up. And it’s not like I told the county to go dump truck, potash out there in my clear cut. It’s because there’s a nutrient cycling system where the ground is already nutrient dense stuff grows and falls down decays gets processed, gets brought back up again, we’re in a Ford system, we have the nutrients in the ground plant takes up nutrients, we remove all the tissue, but then there’s not enough to replenish that. And you could say, like, Well, hey, listen, I I’m putting dairy manure out there. I’m, I’m finishing up the cycle, some but most times, it’s not enough, right? You’ve got to have this balance of like, immediate Nutrient Application residue on the top part of the soil, where you can have long term nutrient release, and also having that residue covered to kind of manage everything from soil temp. And like you said, they have like that balance between macro and micronutrients. Great. Thanks, man. Sorry, I nerd it out right there. I always get excited talking about like that, that nutrient cycle stuff.

Michael Geissinger 26:02
No, I think it’s awesome. And the potassium thing is huge. It’s something that I see a lot with the grazers that I work with, even if it’s just the often like to nutrient

Matt Oehmican 26:14
and it can be and it’s completely misdiagnosed the end. The only reason I caught wind of this is this, this fella had grass that was yellowing, and then it had this, this discoloration on the leaf that when you identified it and looked like a disease, but everybody kept screaming at me, like just put nitrogen on it, it’s nitrogen deficient, just put nitrogen on it’s like, well, so then you pull a soil test will potassium parts per million was below 30. So then you dig in a little bit more of like what potassium does for a plant and you’re like, we got weak tissue, more prone to disease. Why don’t we put some potash out there. And I even did that to a guy last year on the on the west side of the state in the drought where the field was yellow and looked terrible. And I said try putting potash out there. And everybody laughed. They’re like, it’s that it’s yellow because it’s dry. And I’m like, Just try it. And I’m not even kidding it. It started to green up. granted a rainfall came but that he they said that that hay field did better where they put the potash versus the fields were they did put that potash because they were as curious as I was. So there’s something definitely to it. Everything always has a story. You just got to figure. It’s just it’s just trying to figure out what chapter to turn to first.

Michael Geissinger 27:28
Well, that’s agronomy. Cool. Well, yeah, definitely appreciate the conversation on management. With both of you. We did want to kind of wrap things up here talking about sort of the integration of these and I know we’ve talked about it throughout, but maybe to just make it a little bit more explicit for people that might be listening. So like, are these you know, warm season annual forages? Like we’re talking about? Are they only at best on yours like when we have abnormally dry conditions or forage inventories are low? Or is there some merit to including these forages in a regular rotation? And maybe kind of adding some more food for thought there? How would they fit in the year like we’ve had so far this summer that’s been particularly wet and maybe July if you want to take the lead on that on with him? Go ahead.

Yoana Newman 28:21
Well, and you know, the, the summer annuals are, they’re basically in, in my view, like an insurance you know, the more diversity that you have, the more flexibility that you have, you know, you you can you can play with with different species, you know, right now we have an excess of rain. But we don’t know when when you know, when this rain is gonna stop and then we may hit kind of like a horse, you know, where we have maybe enter maybe like a short drought, then you have some resources that can help whether they’re, you know, the what I call the true tropicals, you know, the sorghums per millet or whether we have some of the other species they’ll give you some flexibility they may allow you to rest your cool seasons that tend to be very low yielding during the summer times. And then by having some of these you know, you can extend the grazing season when you add some of the we haven’t talked so much about the legumes but when you have legumes could be cool seasons that you can add versin Clover more for more clay with soils you know it’s not cold tolerant even though it’s pushed into it will extend the production season for you. So yeah, I see them more as a you know as an insurance due to the to the F flexability they bring us cover crops, some of them tend to produce earlier into the into the summer. Some of them tend to produce later in the summer, early fall, like the brassicas, and and you have some nutrition in them, you know, the true tropical summer species, you know, they’re second behind corn, but they will provide high protein like like the sorghum, maybe a couple, you know, they’re not energy feeds. But in the case of sore gums highly palatable. And they bring that possibly one or two percentage points on on protein, so maybe 9% 10% 11% protein. The the key issue here, especially if you’re in a in an irrigated system, they will be in a lot, they will bring a lot of savings, because they’re very water use efficient. If nothing else, you’re saving into your water in bills. Yeah, they you know, it provides that flexibility opportunity to spread your risk, you know, while you wait for the backbone of our industry, the cool season, grasses and legumes.

Will Fulwider 31:24
Great. Thanks, Matt, you have any thoughts about integration or some last parting? tidbits?

Matt Oehmican 31:31
How much time do you have? Oh, man. So I wrote a few things down. And this is the order I wrote them in when it comes to integration and what I see most common when people are talking about these train wreck weather that’s the primary drive number one, small grains, and I’ll explain that here in a second. And costs of production. So train wreck weather, that’s self explanatory, right? Um, I had it were in the Sparta region. I shout out to Gavin. He did sorghum, and a Berseem clover blend. And in the in the drought. It hardly came up. And he it didn’t work out. But he took a brassica blend that he was going to use as like a prime to prime the field to get ready for a new seeding. And that’s what he ended up grazing his animals on the most because he was able to get like multiple grazings off but and I saw that Jason Kathy Dinis when he did a pasture recovery mix that had a little bit of Raskin, Olson, Italian ryegrass, and he got four grazings off of it. So you can have these these species in these lands that can adapt quickly to the weather. But you know, it’s at the end of the day. That’s the reason that people bring this up. Now small grains, this is a wire, I talked about integration, you can’t be the way that people can integrate these summer annuals, or even just like a cheaters way to get an alternative forage with winter cereals. So like winter wheat or rye, you have them plant that following soybeans or corn silage, and then you can plant it at a tick rate, and then put a little bit of nitrogen on the spring. And then you could get yourself a really good cutting. So one, fella told me that his RFQ was above 190. And then he had protein levels at 20%. But that was after they did a dribble bar application when it was about like two feet tall of like 15 gallons of 28% defeated along a little bit, but then you’ve cut that. So then the next question somebody brings up like, Well, what do I plant here now? And you can either integrate that into like, well, let’s do corn, let’s do late planted corn silage or early planted corn silage or, you know, what do you want to do another summer annual mix to help set that up, you know what I mean? And then let’s go back to small grains, let’s say if they do like a forage like a forage Oh, plus Laker oats, you do a cutting of that same thing, all of a sudden, you have this blank canvas and a lot of time to see multiple things. And then the grower is kind of tickled pink because all of a sudden you had this opportunity of double cropping. And that goes into this cost of production model. And that was a conversation I had with a grower to is, you know, you can afford to take a little bit of a yield hit as long as you’re doing two harvests in one season, right, because you’re double cropping, especially in northern Central Wisconsin. That’s not easy to do, and it’s really advantageous. And then also, if you look at some of these alternative forages like sorghum, you’re looking at like anywhere between like maybe 55 bucks to all the way up to like 89 bucks per bag, depending on what variety you get. And you’re covering a few acres per bag and you’re getting similar yields to corn silage, where you’re paying a bag that’s like 303 $150 You know, all of a sudden that’s like that makes a lot of sense. And then also cost of production. If people are looking at Have their marginal acres, and they’re not ready to commit to a perennial system like a pollinator vegetative strip, or maybe like a grass hay next. Those are great ways to integrate these alternative forages or the summer annuals of like, hey, let’s put this out here right now. Let it do its thing. If you can harvest it great. If we let it go full, that’s fine, too. And that gives them time to plot out what they want to do in those marginal acres that will dang their overall yield average on the whole field, which that kind of things the checkbook as well, if that makes sense.

Will Fulwider 35:33
Totally. Thanks, folks, for sharing your thoughts with us today. And coming in and talking with us. We really appreciate it.

Matt Oehmican 35:41
This was a lot of fun. And I’m kind of curious, why are you talking in a box? Well, I’m talking in a warehouse too. So we’re all out of our element.

Will Fulwider 35:51
Right. So here, this is what it sounds like with the box right? And then I’m going to take apart the box and you can hear the difference. So on so you see how much louder it is and more echoey and we got to think out of the box. Yeah. Take apart the box. It’s a whole thing. It’s it’s representative of the larger thinking of summer annuals. Right? You got to think outside the box we will destroys the box at the end.

Matt Oehmican 36:17
Oh man. That was, that was a mind. That was a mind pretzel right there.

Michael Geissinger 36:22
It’s Tuesday morning, Will.

Matt Oehmican 36:25
Good morning, everybody. Time to turn your brain into a pretzel

Will Fulwider 36:37
Thanks for listening. This has been field notes from UW Madison extension. My name is Will Fulwider, regional crops educator for Dane and Dodge counties. And I was joined by my co host, Michael Geissinger outreach specialist in Northwest Wisconsin with the nutrient and pest management program at UW Madison. A big thank you to Joe Ryan for creating our theme music and to Abby Wilkymacky for a logo. If you have any questions about anything you’ve heard today, or about your farming practices in general, reach out to the extension agriculture educators serving your region.

Transcribed by https://otter.ai